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Print Page oldski-doosleds' Vintage Ski-Doo Message Board
    oldski-doosleds Message Board => Help Desk (Only) => Message started by: Doo640ER on July  2, 2011, 04:45:39 AM
	

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Title: 67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on July 2, 2011, 04:45:39 AM

I noticed yesterday that the rear sprokets on my 67 Oly are toast, actually look like mush. :-[ I think this happened because the rear set of bogies was seized in a bad position and let the track ride high and outside the track windows. I had the track spinning yesterday and there was little chunks of rubber and rubber dust all over. :(
So I'll be replacing the rear sprockets. It may be personal preference, but what are you guys replacing the rears with, The rubber or the hard plastic? And Where's the best place to get them? Gonna replace the all the rear springs too while I'm in there.
Thanks, Mark


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 1970TNT on July 2, 2011, 05:07:31 AM

DOO640ER I USE ONLY THE HARD PLASTIC/FRONT DRIVERS ON ALL MY SLEDS. I HAVE HAD PROBLEMS WITH THE ORGINAL RUBBER ONES ON TRACKS THAT DOO NOT GET USED ALOT OR A SLED THAT HAS BEEN SITING FOR AWHILE. THEY WILL "WALK" OUT OF THE HOLES IN THE TRACK.

SOURCE IS SMARTREC 800 871 8966 GET THE KIMPLEX SPROCKETS ONLY SEE PIC OF SPI AFTER 20 MINUTES OF USAGE :o :o PART NUMBER KX 4102 MAKE SURE YA ASK FOR KIMPLEX!!!


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on July 2, 2011, 07:06:01 AM

Thanks YETI, doo ya have a part number for the seals? Also what bearings did the 67 use? The typical 6205?

I see Kimpex makes the hard plastic 04-102 and rubber 04-103 sprockets. Some say to use the rubber on the rear because riding on a hard surface can break the plastic sprocket. I have the hard plastic ones on my Nordic and they doo appear chipped.

Doo you know if Smart Rec sells the bogie and link plate springs? I didn't see them on their website.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: hermit on July 2, 2011, 11:04:25 PM

I've had great luck with the oem nos rubber sprockets in all cases and they haven't shredded. Maybe they had a better durometer rubber compound. The 570-0101 or 570-0118's on the back and the oem nylons 572010200 on the front. However even ski-doo super'd the rear rubber ones with their nylon ones on the last made elans. Theirs are not quite as hard as the kimpex ones, but have never had them get whittled down like the spi ones shown. It's too bad the spi ones' closest mimick the oem ones. Last i knew the oem ones were still available from Bombi at like 20.00ea thereabouts. I think its a pref thing, and if you are riding on snow and general ice as opposed to rocks and that the hard ones ought to be fine. There are a lot in service. I heard the price spiked huge this year though so hold on.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on July 4, 2011, 06:11:22 AM

Thanks Hermit for the part numbers. I think I'll go with the rubber ones for the rear. I doo tend to doo a lot of riding on hard pack roads around here, plus if I change these now, I'll never have to doo it again regardless. I'll never put that many miles on it.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: INVADER70 on July 4, 2011, 07:11:17 AM

For what it's worth I always use the Kimpex rubber sprockets on the rear and have never had any problems with the tracks jumping on them. But then again I don't get many miles on my sleds around here.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on July 5, 2011, 02:29:27 PM

[quote author=INVADER70 link=board=1;threadid=18477;start=0#msg108349 date=1309788677]
For what it's worth I always use the Kimpex rubber sprockets on the rear and have never had any problems with the tracks jumping on them. But then again I don't get many miles on my sleds around here.
[/quote]

Thanks Tony, I like all the advice and opinions I can get. Word of mouth and real-life experiences of others really help out when making educated decisions. ;)


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: chickenplucker on July 27, 2011, 09:38:58 AM

Just ordered a set of Kimpex sprockets from Smart Power Sports for about $9 something a piece (on backorder). The guy I spoke with said that the other of the two companys they get parts through was listing them for around $25 a piece now. Also thanks for the info and part numbers, it really helped in tracking the sprockets down.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: goose on August 2, 2011, 08:55:32 AM

I have the rear rubber ones in stock if you need a set right away. Shoot me an email ron.thomsen@gmail.com


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Dug3x3 on September 5, 2011, 12:04:52 PM

I also have hundreds of the hard and soft kimpex sprockets in stock all the time. thanks, doug
Link below.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Dug3x3 on September 9, 2011, 12:23:42 PM

WOW ! I see my supplier just changed the retail price from $10.49 to $25.00ea, WTF!


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on December 11, 2011, 08:05:57 AM

Finally got a little bit of time to work on the 67 today. Assembly of the sprockets and axles on the kitchen island countertop. 23 degrees F outside :D and pretty cold in the garage. No heat to speak of. Wife loves when I doo things like this, but as long as I have a smile on my face then she does too ;)




Got the stainless steel screws and locking nuts from McMaster Carr. 330-995-5500. I have posted the info here in hopes it could help someone else who comes along searching.

10-32 Thread X 5/8" Screws: Part # 91783A830 Qty 2 packs @ 100 per box @ $6.05 per box

Nylon Lock nuts part # 90715A115 Qty 3 packs @ 50 per box @ $10.41 per box.

Not cheap ::) but will last my and the sled's lifetime. I used the John Deere Medium Gloss Black paint, which you can see now needs to be touched up. I think I'll paint the screws also to make it look more original. Haven't decided.

The front sprockets are the Kimpex hard plastic version. The rears are hard plastic also and were produced by Marshall. I like that they are black and look more like the original soft rubber ones. Now on to the bogie assemblies :o :o :o
18 screws down and 72 to go ;D


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Bones on December 11, 2011, 01:01:11 PM

Lookin` good Doo640ER ;)
I don`t think my wife would be pleased with Doo parts in the kitchen ;D

Question for all:....Why when U fellas install new axle sprockets doo `ya all use screws with pan heads rather than bolts with hex head ???
Bones


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: ddub on December 11, 2011, 03:33:24 PM

[quote]Question for all:....Why when U fellas install new axle sprockets doo `ya all use screws with pan heads rather than bolts with hex head
Bones
[/quote]

Bones, I was wondering the same!


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: skunked on December 11, 2011, 04:45:16 PM

Panheads are more aerodynamic. Gotta have an edge. LOL


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 72elan250 on December 11, 2011, 05:22:42 PM

i always use 1/4 #20 hex bolts only because they are free. so are the nuts and lock washers so no ny-locks for me.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 1970TNT on December 11, 2011, 07:16:46 PM

I USE SS ALLEN BUTTON HEAD SCREW. THEY LOOK LIKE RIVETS FROM A DISTANCE ;D ;D YETI


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 75 Elan on December 12, 2011, 02:29:55 AM

[quote author=1970TNT link=board=1;threadid=18477;start=0#msg112745 date=1323659806]
I USE SS ALLEN BUTTON HEAD SCREW. THEY LOOK LIKE RIVETS FROM A DISTANCE ;D ;D YETI
[/quote]

x2


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on December 12, 2011, 10:43:44 AM

Only one reason I used pan head screws. That's what was original to the sled. Unfortunately I apparently have a little OCD and want it to look as original as possible. :- This is likely good news for some of the site sponsors and I'm putting together a shopping list. Are there bulk discounts ? :o

Thanks for the great comments guys!


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 72elan250 on December 12, 2011, 04:20:06 PM

does anyone know what year they switched over to rivets?


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Doo640ER on December 13, 2011, 05:54:56 AM


on 1323735606, 73elan250 wrote:

does anyone know what year they switched over to rivets?


69 was the last year for the screws and nylock nuts.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Bones on December 13, 2011, 08:04:01 AM

[quote author=Doo640ER link=board=1;threadid=18477;start=0#msg112757 date=1323715424]
Only one reason I used pan head screws. That's what was original to the sled.
[/quote]
OK, good point......I just couldn`t figure why any one would use em when you could use hex head etc.
Bones


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: hermit on December 13, 2011, 09:19:14 AM

My '69 had all panheads, bogies and sprockets. I was lucky none were rusted. But taking them all off by hand was "fun". My 65 has phillips heads which are easier to handle than flatheads.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 75 Elan on December 13, 2011, 09:57:57 AM

Both my 67s, had all hex, boggy wheels were all bombi originals. So no aftermarket. You would think that was factory.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: EricR on December 13, 2011, 11:13:19 AM

Another thing was they used what they got at a good price in bulk from a supplier.

I watch that Bombi video that shows the assembly of '67's, and how they used no primer what so ever, the chassis came through hung like a side of beef and got hosed down with alkyd enamel (think Rustoleum type) then I assume run through an oven of sorts to speed the drying process so they could go on to further assembly.

You see the way a guy just dumps a single engine down on top of the tunnel, then gets a new grip and drops it on the mounting studs? No concern for the scratches that likely were hidden by the seat later!

I'm putting my '70 together and laying towels down before I lay wrenches on the tunnel.. ::)

Often with these old machines the discussion of what is the correct color match comes up. With fiberglass parts, the particular batch of gel coat used on a given day may have varied from what they used a week earlier.

Most "restored" machines to me are assembled with more detail than they likely came from the factory.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 75 Elan on December 13, 2011, 11:54:23 AM

wow this is straying form to OP


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: EricR on December 13, 2011, 04:13:17 PM

Ddub started it............ ;D

Sorry if I dragged this off track. I re used the straight slot pan heads on my '69, they were not rusty and it was one less thing I had to buy.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: 1970TNT on December 13, 2011, 04:41:40 PM

1970 SLEDS HAD RIVETS >:(


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: ironjoe on December 26, 2011, 09:34:27 PM

Just weighing in with my opinion, I tried the 4103 black rubber sprockets on the back of my 72 tnt but I could not get the track to stop jumping out. I have the white, hard 4102 sprockets on the front and rear now and no problems.
I believe the rubber ones are correct but after 40 years or so the tracks are a bit less supple.
I used slot pan heads too, only because they were cheap.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: cdem72 on April 5, 2012, 09:04:49 AM

I believe the OEM Bombardier ones are obsolete as I was told I got the last 3 pair a couple of years ago; but they may have continued manufacturing them because of the number of sleds that use them, I don't know for sure.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: oldstuffguy on August 12, 2012, 01:55:36 PM

Hello
I'll have 4 early original types done by late fall, SK20,570-0101 in rubber, and 414-0001, 414-0327 in UHMW material.

Greg Spaulding


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Rockalicious on November 6, 2013, 04:44:47 PM

Doo you guys have any advice on how to remove the sprockets? My repair manual shows and explains to use two flat head screwdrivers to pry the old sprockets out. I tried and it looks like I would be bending the flanges on either side. The sprockets are in there pretty deep and after 40 years I am not too sure on how pliable they are.

Also, my '70 oly 12/3 came with pan heads.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: hermit on November 6, 2013, 08:52:27 PM

Drill the rivets or unbolt/break the rusted bolts when doing so and slide the flanges off. Good news on Greg Spaulding's making new sprockets.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: EricR on November 7, 2013, 09:05:18 AM

Rockalicious, is your issue that the outer steel flanges won't move? The inner steel flanges are tack welded to the shaft, the outers are supposed to float, but they get rusted on. I had to nearly destroy some to get them off before. Lots of penetrating lube and torch heat were needed, then I had to straighten my flanges as they got pretty mangled.

I'd have just gotten a better donor shaft but didn't have the time.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Rockalicious on November 7, 2013, 03:45:44 PM

Thanks by's. I couldn't see prying them off working according to the manual so I thought about them floating around but after some whacking I wasn't so sure. They are rusted on pretty good so I'll heat them up. Makes sense that the inner is fixed.


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Joe Olympique on November 7, 2013, 05:21:41 PM

You can also try a beefy pin punch set sideways into a bolt hole with a moderate hammer hit, this might break the flange loose, careful not to mangle the hole though. Also, firmly in the vice, you can give the sprocket itself a good whack, straight down, that might get things spinning freely.
I had one axle where that approach broke of a nice big chunk of old sprocket. It was then a pretty easy task to dig the rest of the sprocket out allowing me to work the stuck flange from both sides


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Title: Re:67 Needs New Rear Sprockets
Post by: Rockalicious on November 7, 2013, 06:44:05 PM

[quote author=Joe Olympique link=board=1;threadid=18477;start=20#msg128787 date=1383873701]
You can also try a beefy pin punch set sideways into a bolt hole with a moderate hammer hit, this might break the flange loose, careful not to mangle the hole though. Also, firmly in the vice, you can give the sprocket itself a good whack, straight down, that might get things spinning freely.
I had one axle where that approach broke of a nice big chunk of old sprocket. It was then a pretty easy task to dig the rest of the sprocket out allowing me to work the stuck flange from both sides
[/quote]


Thanks. Tried those moves tonight. Got one of the buggers loose and off just when I was loosing faith and beginning to think that I have the only completely welded axle! I managed to dig out the sprocket and then use a bearing puller on it. The other one however is putting up a good fight.. there is always one that doesn't want to come easy eh >:(



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