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  Are the Lights Spirits?
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   Author  Topic: Are the Lights Spirits?  (Read 5944 times)
yonahmtn253
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Are the Lights Spirits?
« on: June 12, 2006, 11:59:25 AM »
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I know much as been written, speculated, studied...you name it about the lights. After hearing Cindy at Parkview's encounter with an upclose orb of light, I came to my own conclusion. I have been an orthodox Christian forever but I have begun to search for more on the divinity of God as a Divine Light." In the beginning was Light" is how Genesis begins. I feel that we all have a divine light inside us and that when our earthly body dies our light lives on. Just think of all the people who have had near death experiences. What do they always see first...A LIGHT! To me this makes the most sense of all. Cindy said that the light approached them but they did not feel afraid. Maybe these are lost or tormented souls that have not found their way to heaven or beyond.  This phenenomon has been most reported to be seen on BML but it is also occuring in other places now (Thomas Divide ). Maybe these lights are trying to communicate with us in some way and have something of importance to tell us. I'm not a UFO believer but I have become a Gnostic Believer. Gnostic mean knowledge, this knowledge is an inner light that resides in each of us.
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parkviewlodge
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2006, 05:56:14 PM »
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I have always felt these lights have an intelligence.  And yes like you. I'm not so sure about the UFO idea. Although my husband and children witnessed a UFO at Wisemens View many years ago. I am not opposed to the lights being UFO's. Just not sure. I tend to lean toward the spirit idea. But that is my personality. I have seen spirit, I understand spirits.  And UFO's scare me just a bit.

It was great spending time with you this weekend. And we will go to Wisemans View next time your here ....together. I enjoyed my saturday evening at Wisemans View, but I knew I would not see any of the lights. There was some negative engery there. With all the research folks.

The lights are gifts not always shared. WE were given the gift of the music and the good weather and the beautiful full moon over Table Rock.

Cindy
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Charles
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2006, 06:27:59 PM »
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I know much as been written, speculated, studied...you name it about the lights.

Quote:
I have always felt these lights have an intelligence.

From the lab experiment conducted by L.E.M.U.R., it appears the mystery has been solved.  Their experiments on recreating the Lights confirm the long held belief that the lights are an electromagnetic plasma phenomenon resulting from the peculiar geology of the mountains in that area.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2006, 06:29:00 PM by Charles » Logged

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yonahmtn253
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2006, 05:37:47 PM »
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I believe that LEMUR thinks it is a plasma formed for the geology of the mountain but I also believe that this plasma has life to it. I still stick with my theory that we were all created from The Light and we return to the light when we die. How do you explain all the orbs of light that have been found in haunted places? Are these som mysterious forms of plasma, too? I think that BMLs have a spirit to them.
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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2006, 01:12:11 PM »
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I believe when we see 'orbs'. that we are looking at the human soul and that it is a component of existance while living in this realm. I think there are More true orbs in our photos than dust particles.
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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2006, 03:09:32 PM »
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    When there is 'purpose' to their movement that can't be delegated to being 'random' then there's something more to it than say the Southern Light effect . .
otherwise known as "Austrailius Borealis".
    There seems to be something there if people are being followed. Is there a sense of 'watching' or of feeling like you are not alone?
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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2006, 03:13:34 PM »
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I meant to mention about sound. While taking a video anyone if you can, I wonder if it could be delegated to a DVR for AV examination? I'm sure Joshua's team would be more than happy to accomidate you
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Charles
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2006, 08:09:07 PM »
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yonamtn253 said:
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I also believe that this plasma has life to it.

Why do you think this electromagnetic plasma meets the current qualifications for life as defined by biologists ?

[1] Organized structures that are composed of heterogeneous chemicals - in units of "cells"
[2] Metabolism: chemical and energy transformations
[3] Maintain internal conditions separated from an outside environment: homeostasis
[4] Growth: conversion of materials from the environment into components of organism
[5] Reaction to select stimuli, physiologically and/or behaviorally
[6] Reproduction: making copies of individuals via the mechanism of genetic transfer: sections of DNA molecules that contain instructions for organization & metabolism
[7] Evolution: change in characteristics of individuals, resulting from mutation & natural selection - these result in adaptations

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I still stick with my theory that we were all created from The Light

What is your foundation upon which this hypothesis is based ?  What is this Light you refer to ? You wording suggests you are not using the word in its standard meaning.  Are you assigning a religious meaning to this plasma ?

Quote:
How do you explain all the orbs of light that have been found in haunted places? Are these som mysterious forms of plasma, too?

There are several origins for the orbs the vast majority of them are images produced by light reflecting from dust particles or water droplets close to the camera lens which render them out of focus.

nik347mhz said:
Quote:
I believe when we see 'orbs'. that we are looking at the human soul and that it is a component of existance while living in this realm.

This is a common belief.  But it assumes the existence of the soul, for which there is no evidence.  It then further assumes that the soul can exist outside the body, for which there is no evidence.  And it assumes that this unknown entity can transform itself into some form of matter or energy which can be photographed, and that it would allow itself to be photographed after the death of its host.  Does this seem like too many unsupported assumptions ?

Quote:
When there is 'purpose' to their movement that can't be delegated to being 'random' then there's something more to it than say the Southern Light effect

Do you have evidence that there has ever been a purpose to the movement of the BML rather than their motion being random ?  I have never read of any patterns or organization being observed in their motion. Have you ?  Your use of the word purpose suggests you think there is a cognitive ability embodied in this plasma.  Is that what you are suggesting ? The lightning produced by storms is also electromagnetic plasma.  Do you think there could be a purpose to those plasma displays too ?

Quote:
There seems to be something there if people are being followed

Virtually all of the sightings of the BML are from a great distance.  There are no reliable reports of people being on the mountain in the midst of the lights and seeing them close up.  Why do you think they have been known to follow people ?
« Last Edit: July 19, 2006, 08:22:02 PM by Charles » Logged

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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2006, 12:36:46 PM »
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Firstly, it's purely speculation that they are in fact plasma and this is where 'ongoing investigation'  comes in and 'that' is why we have 'ongoing discussion'. Otherwise it's assumption and presumption. With the DVR analysis we can bring it as far as we are able to bring it 'up to this point 'until' we find a new process and THAT is why science only goes so far after all we JUST developed the ion engine 'didn't we'. But keep the faith there's always something new around the corner
(as far as this physical realm is concerned)
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yonahmtn253
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2006, 05:14:04 PM »
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I have no scientific evidence to prove anything. I guess I rely on my spiritual beliefs. The "Light" is something that lies in each of us whether we are religious or not. It is the soul and the heart. There is light in plants, rocks, etc. Do you not feel this plasma has some kind of life to it or do you think it is a scientific investigation? We all have our opinions and I respect yours as I hope you do mine! I am somewhat of a romantic who still wants to think it is a spirit, a past life, a living life that still exists in these Blue Ridge Mountains.

All I know is after all the different experiences that people have had with the BML on this Discussion Board, it is not to be dismissed as scientific plasma that has no life!
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Charles
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2006, 07:54:12 PM »
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I have no scientific evidence to prove anything. I guess I rely on my spiritual beliefs. The "Light" is something that lies in each of us whether we are religious or not. It is the soul and the heart.

Spiritualism, mysticism, and religion offer little support when it comes to understanding natural phenomena and the laws of the universe.  Those three philosophies ground themselves in the realm of the supernatural for which there are no rules, other than what each person chooses to make up for himself.  For example, some say that dwelling inside each of us is a Darkness that struggles to return us to the Well of Evil from which everything we know sprang in ages past.  Which mystical theory is true ?  We have no way to tell the supernatural realm does not permit us to test any hypothesis.  Every moment the rules of the supernatural change.

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There is light in plants, rocks,

One can believe this on faith, but there is no evidence of this.  And we have studied plants and rocks very extensively.  Suppose we assume that there is some undiscovered inner aspect of mysterious light within all things.  What can we do with that knowledge ?  If we cant use that knowledge to accomplish something measurable, how do we know it is there ?

Quote:
Do you not feel this plasma has some kind of life to it or do you think it is a scientific investigation?

I believe the preponderance of the evidence supports the hypothesis that the BML are a natural, electromagnetic plasma phenomenon.  I do not believe they are ghosts or spiritual manifestations or alien life forms or the by-products of an omnipresent mystical Light.

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We all have our opinions and I respect yours as I hope you do mine!

While I respect your right to have your own opinion, that is not the same as respecting the opinion itself.  Science is not about respecting opinions.  It relies upon testability, falsifiability, and plausibility.  Our knowledge of the universe is based upon this process.

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I am somewhat of a romantic who still wants to think it is a spirit, a past life, a living life that still exists in these Blue Ridge Mountains.

Thats ok.  But I hope you understand that we will never find useful answers to real-world questions with such philosophy.  There was a time that people believed disease was Gods punishment of a person for doing something bad.  If we had followed that view, medicine would have never evolved.

Quote:
All I know is after all the different experiences that people have had with the BML on this Discussion Board, it is not to be dismissed as scientific plasma that has no life!

I first saw the BML 40 years ago.  They were very impressive.  Since then, I have read many, many accounts of peoples sightings of them.  Nothing I have ever read leads me to believe that these lights have prescience, intelligence, organization, will power, or any connection to a supernatural world.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2006, 07:56:04 PM by Charles » Logged

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yonahmtn253
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2006, 07:10:07 AM »
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WHATEVER, CHARLES! ......
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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2006, 12:30:46 PM »
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As I said earlier, there seems to be a sence of purpose and order with the movement of these lights. Too many have reported being followed.  The Northern lights don't 'follow' people and it's determined that they take on a similar structure to very bright orbs.
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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2006, 12:38:33 PM »
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As I said before, these lights have a sense of purpose, they are structured similar to orbs and they seem to have a sense of purpose to their movement. There have been too many people that have apparently been followed.
    Has anyone use the meters on them, EMF and  EVP?
Fully investigate them along those lines. They certainly are attracting a lot of people. Is there a sense of someone watching? The feeling, I mean. We do have an inner radar that alerts us and gives us just a modicum response if it's nothing but a lightning storm with nothing but electricity. If the video DVRs were examined you might find something.
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Charles
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2006, 04:15:33 PM »
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There have been too many people that have apparently been followed.

In all of the reports I have read over the years, I have never read this.  Can you give us the links to the sites where these people you refer to have reported being followed on the mountain by the lights ?  That would be helpful.
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yonahmtn253
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2006, 06:28:07 PM »
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Look at the post "Chased by the lights?" There are others.
Charles face it. You are scientifically trying to explain this phenomonon and I am romancing the idea that it is a spirit. We're on different ends of the spectrum.

Quote from strrynght514:
My husband and I were at the Wisemans View lookout on November 5, 2005 and watched plenty of lights.  I've seen them several times, it was his first time up there.  When I saw them in the past they stayed over on the ridge and maybe halfway down to the creek below.  This time there were 3 reddish orange lights down in the creek area around 6:00 pm. One went out, another stayed down there but the 3rd light kept getting closer.  It was probably about halfway between the creek and the lookout and gaining speed and brightness when my husband decided it was time to go.  Once we got up to the paved walkway we started to really hurry. He told me not to look back (I get the freeze reaction) but I did anyway.  The light shot up above the lookout where we had been standing and came straight towards us like it was chasing us.  When I looked back again it was gone.  Has anyone else had the lights appear to be chasing them?  I've never heard of this before.  Since we don't know what they are we werent going to stick around to find out either. We are going to try to go back this weekend and hopefully we will see it again and stay a bit longer. Please share your stories if anyone has had something similar happen. Thanks![/b][b]
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Charles
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2006, 01:01:57 PM »
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You are scientifically trying to explain this phenomonon and I am romancing the idea that it is a spirit. We're on different ends of the spectrum.

Obviously, but in its investigations of paranormal phenomena, the LEMUR team chooses to use the scientific method.  That is how they conducted their experiment to recreate the plasma that supports their hypothesis that the BML are an electromagnetic plasma phenomenon.

Fantasy and romance do not offer any way to test anything, so using those approaches is not compatible with the scientific method.  I do not know of any empirical method for collecting real, measurable data to test the spirit hypothesis.  So believing that hypothesis becomes a matter of faith which is fine as long as one recognizes that.

When visitors come here looking for information about the nature and origin of the BML, they should get the best information available.  So they should know that while they are free to believe things like the lights are ghosts of Indian warriors or dead slaves searching for their masters, spirit beings from another dimension, extraterrestrial probes collecting information, fairies or wood sprites, super secret military projects, or any of the other romantic theories some might post here all of these fall into the least plausible hypothesis category.  There is no evidence to support them, but there is evidence that provides a more plausible answer.  Those who prefer to still believe that they are ghosts certainly have that right.  But the question that leaps forth is why would someone want to believe something for which there is not a shred of evidence ?

Quote:
The light shot up above the lookout where we had been standing and came straight towards us like it was chasing us.  When I looked back again it was gone.  Has anyone else had the lights appear to be chasing them?

This is the only case that I can remember that anyone said the lights actually left Brown Mountain and came up to Wisemans View overlook or to any of the other overlooks on the Parkway or elsewhere.  These people perhaps felt like they might have been chased, but they dont seem sure.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2006, 03:36:57 PM by Charles » Logged

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nik347mhz
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2006, 01:08:28 PM »
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It's true that people perceive something on emotion many times and assume things about what they saw,

but I must address the issue about belief, in that it doesn't require evidence. If a guy said that to his wife I don't think the marriage would last long

ON another note, maybe the BML's are akin to the Northern and Southern Lights only 'different' and 'localized' .....thots for the day :)
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Charles
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2006, 06:25:45 PM »
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I must address the issue about belief, in that it doesn't require evidence. If a guy said that to his wife I don't think the marriage would last long

Opinions and faith do not require evidenceuntil one decides to use them in an intellectual argument to convince another person of their validity or use them to prove another point. 

Hypotheses presented as solutions to problems have to be tested by giving evidence.  In science, hypotheses must be testable and falsifiable to be valid.  There must be a way to collect data about it, and if must be possible to prove it is wrong if it really is wrong.  So the hypothesis We are surrounded by invisible aliens from another dimension, but we will never be able to detect them is not testable and hence not falsifiable.  We have worded it in such a way as to make testing impossible.
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yonahmtn253
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Re:Are the Lights Spirits?
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2006, 06:48:22 AM »
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Obviously you (Charles) do not believe it God either. Belief in something sometimes requires a "Leap of Faith. Believing in something untangible that you may not be able to touch, feel or explain. Science seems to be your driven motive and explaination for eveything. Seems a bit sad that our world has to always be explained in scentific terms.
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